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Posted by: Jack
« on: November 03, 2019, 04:58:29 pm »

Quote from: Zyngaru on November 03, 2019, 10:14:38 am
As for fears about vaccinations.  I really don't understand fearing a vaccination that is time tested and confirmed to be safe.

This should probably be it's own topic, and I might move it that way, if this takes off.

The simple and correct answer is that it's not about vaccines, it's about conspiracy theories.  As to why people believe those conspiracy theories.... That's a much more complex question.

Personally, I think a lot of it comes down to a combination of Nixon, McCarthyism, and modern method's of communication and travel.

McCarthyism not only played up paranoia, but deliberately built it.  Nixon showed that no one can be trusted.  Modern communication and the 24/7 news cycle means you're going to hear about things that would never have been on your radar once.  Modern travel means many people are basically gypsies now and a lot of people probably don't even know their neighbors, much less the family down the block.

I think that all combines to create a general atmosphere of distrust - not so much for individuals, but in general.  My dad remembers the family doctor coming by to check on him when he had a bad flu bug.  I remember going to the same pediatrician who'd seen my mom and dad as kids.  My kids have a similar experience, but only because I'm business partners with the doctor, and I've known him since he was a teenager.  Most people don't have that experience, and it's much harder to deal with 'generic pediatrician who saw me at the Urgent Care Clinic' tan it is someone you've known your entire life.

This can go on a lot longer, but I hope it expresses my general thoughts.
Posted by: Zyngaru
« on: November 03, 2019, 10:14:38 am »

Quote from: Jack on November 03, 2019, 07:49:24 am
I had already seen this article, and, as I recall, they're making an effort to capture the women who posted this, since even the thread can result in a 10 year jail sentence.  I certainly consider deliberately dosing children with a virus as a terroriistic threat.

I am pretty sure legally, intentionally spreading a disease is considered Domestic Terrorism, under modern terrorism laws. I don't know what the law is in Australia, but I would imagine it is a crime there also.  According to the article there is possibly some serious jail time for this person if caught.

One of my little Grand Nephews (One year-old) just got over chickenpox.  He broke out, a week before he was scheduled to get his chicken pox shot.

It was actually a funny story.  My niece called us to talk with her Grandmother, my sister who now lives with me, about her son breaking out.  She sent photos, and we told her that it looked like chicken pox, but she needed a doctor to confirm it, because a lot of rashes look similar.  So she took him in to see his doctor, but told them at the desk when she checked in that she thought her son might have chicken pox.  They took her and the boy right in.  No waiting.

As for fears about vaccinations.  I really don't understand fearing a vaccination that is time tested and confirmed to be safe.

I do understand concern about a new vaccination, that has not yet been tested over time.  When I was a boy, being a military brat, the government used the military to test things like vaccinations.  Me and my brothers were slated to take the brand-new Polio vaccine, which was taken orally, not by needle.  Luckily my dad decided his kids would not be used as guinea pigs, because the first tests of the drug was too strong of a dose and actually gave kids polio.  They weakened the dosage and it has become a solid vaccine for preventing polio, but those first kids who took the drug, suffered with polio the rest of their lives.  I could have been one of them.  So yes I understand the fear of brand new vaccines and drugs.
Posted by: Jack
« on: November 03, 2019, 07:49:24 am »

I think the problem is this site doesn't hot link well and in most cases, they're pretty distinct.  At 'creataforum' they just look like bold text.   That's why I normally just post the URL instead, to make it obvious.

I had already seen this article, and, as I recall, they're making an effort to capture the women who posted this, since even the thread can result in a 10 year jail sentence.  I certainly consider deliberately dosing children with a virus as a terroriistic threat.

I remember growing up at a time when chickenpox was common for kids.  Most of my brothers and I were born in the 60s and 70s, and I remember being rather surprised when my sister (who's 18 years younger than me) got a chicken pox vaccine, since that was the first I was aware there was such a thing.
Posted by: Adric
« on: November 03, 2019, 02:49:22 am »

Zac is correct, and I'm sorry for the confusion.  I assumed that people would open the hot link at the top of my post called Topic For Discussion.  That link goes to:  https://news.yahoo.com/anti-vaxx-mom-says-she-153902456.html?.tsrc=daily_mail&uh_test=2_15

It is a story about a woman who claimed that she was trying to infect all her trick-or-treat visitors with chickenpox by passing out contaminated candy.  She also claimed that she would sell her contaminated candy for $1 Australian to anyone who wanted it.  She is an anti-vaxer, and a criminal.

My point was that it is NOT harmless to get chickenpox as a child.  The only people who can get Shingles are those who had chickenpox when they were children.  Her claimed actions were criminal and irresponsible.

And I agree with Zyngaru that Shingles is a serious condition, so serious that we spent a lot of money on Halloween to reduce our risk.  I had both a relative and a neighbor who got Shingles and were troubled by pain for the rest of their lives.

Again, sorry my post was confusing.
Posted by: Zac
« on: November 02, 2019, 07:51:02 pm »

Quote from: Zyngaru on November 02, 2019, 07:23:10 pm
I'm totally confused by this post.  I'm not sure what it is about.

Pro or Con Singles shots?

I was a little confused myself until I followed the link at the top of Adric's post to a story about "Anti-vax mom says she gave out lollipops tainted with chickenpox for Halloween".
Posted by: Zyngaru
« on: November 02, 2019, 07:23:10 pm »

I'm totally confused by this post.  I'm not sure what it is about.

Pro or Con Singles shots?

I just don't know.

I will say this.  My dad got shingles and it was bad.  My nephew got shingles and it was bad.  Two different people in my immediate family got it, so I talked to my doctor about it and I got the first shot which at that time was only one shot and protected you about 50/50.

A few years later they came out with the double dose shot that is supposed to protect you 90/10.  I opted for the double dose.

I know how bad shingles can be first hand by seeing my dad and nephew deal with it.  If there was a chance to keep me from getting it, I took it.

Like I said.  I don't know if that post was pro or con. 

But I leave medical decisions like that for each person to make for themselves.
Posted by: Adric
« on: November 02, 2019, 01:25:24 pm »

Topic for Discussion

[rant]
Fortunately the effort, if it is even true, was not likely to be successful.  The intent, however, is both criminal and seriously misguided.

"'And I'm offering life long immunity for the price of a couple of blisters and a few days off school,' she added."

What she offers is NOT life long immunity - it is life long risk of a serious and very painful consequence of chickenpox called Shingles.  On Halloween we each spent $172.46 for the first of two vaccinations (Shingrix #1) against Shingles and then spent the next two days with malaise and low-grade fever as the expected reaction.  The follow-up vaccination (Shingrix #2) will likely be about the same price, so our total bill will likely be about $690.  None of that expense and inconvenience would have been necessary if we had not contracted chickenpox as children.

A certain percentage of those who contract Shingles will experience Postherpetic Neuralgia that may cause them to be in pain for months, and in some cases for the rest of their lives.

I would not offer to reason with a dangerous fanatic such as this.  What I would offer is jail time followed by a very long probation with conditions that prohibit her from promoting her dangerous opinions and actions on the internet.  I hope she is caught and prosecuted under the existing laws against her behavior.
[/rant]